Sunday, March 1, 2009

3.1 PTR testing, druid style!

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Ok guys. Wall of text, incoming. I tested quite a few things on the PTR tonight, and even though Lifebloom wasn't one of them (the change isn't on the PTR yet! Whyyyyy), I think I have a lot of decent info here ^^

1. The new talent, Improved Mark of the Wild:
Now also increases all of your total attributes by 2% (with two talent points) in addition to the 40% increase to the buff.

On the PTR, putting two talent points here gives you the exact same buff as putting two talent points in there on the current servers. If you look at the MotW buff tooltips on the PTR and the current server, they're the same. The buff itself doesn't change. But read on for the awesome part =)

This is all with two talent points.

On the PTR, with the extra 2%:

Spirit: Without buff - 1029. With buff - 1089......(+60)
Intellect: Without buff - 936. With buff - 988.....(+52)

On the live server, without the extra 2%:

Spirit: Without buff - 1008. With buff - 1067......(+59)
Intellect: Without buff - 919. With buff - 970.....(+51)


See how the increase is the same? On both servers, Spirit is increased around 60 points, and Intellect is increased around 52 points. (The slight one point difference is most likely just due to rounding, and also due to scaling, which I discuss below). That's the 40% increase to your MotW, which has been around for a while now, and isn't changing come 3.1; it's how the buff has always worked with those talent points. But see how the actual attributes themselves are higher on the PTR? That's due to the +2%.

Let's take a quick look at my spirit, with the two talent points in place. Without the buff on the current server, my spirit is 1008. 2% of that is 21.16, and that's why my spirit on the PTR without the buff is 1029: 1008 + 21.16 = 1029 (rounded).

Let's now look at my spirit WITH the MotW buff. On the current server, it's 1067. If the new PTR talent "+2% to all attributes" scaled with the buff, you would add 2% of 1067 (rather than 2% of the unbuffed 1008), which would be 21.3. 1067 + 21.3 = 1088, which is what my spirit is buffed on the PTR. So it does, in fact, scale.

The important thing to realize is that the +2% to all attributes has nothing to do with the MotW buff, even though it's lumped in there with that talent point. This isn't a buff to the MotW buff, it isn't a buff to raids; it doesn't get applied to people that you put your MotW on. It's only a buff to you and you alone, directly affecting your attributes. Feel special!

Note: The reason spirit is higher on both is due to the three point talent Living Spirit. =)

2. Mana regen.

Oh boy. On the current server, my mana regen is 894 while not casting, 298 while casting. On the PTR, it's 569/306. I checked out how Innervate works - and yeah. Nerf bat to the face.

Note that this is all with 1029 spirit, and with a 17,256 mana pool.

Without Glyph of Innervate, without casting: I hit Innervate when I was in tree form, at zero mana (or as close to zero as I could get) and just sat. Right as innervate fell off, I checked out how much mana I regened. 10.8k. That's 62.6% of my mana regened.

Without Glyph of Innervate, WITH casting: Again, I hit Innervate under the same conditions, only this time I spam casted some spells to simulate PvE healing. I think I hit about 5 lifeblooms, 3 rejuvs and a couple regrowths in the time it took Innervate to finally fall off. I regened 6.8k mana. That's only 39.4% of my total mana pool. I tested this again, while casting various healing spells (trying to keep it similar to what I would do in a raid), and regened 6.1k, which is 35.4% for me. Obviously it depends on which spells I'm casting, but I think it's safe to say that I'll get somewhere in the 30% range if I'm spam-casting while Innervate is on.

This is a pretty hefty nerf. I used to be able to rely on Innervate to top me off even WHILE casting a ton of spells. Not anymore.

I decided to peruse the PTR AH and grab a Glyph of Innervate. There was ONE left. I got it. It was like 500 gold, but whatever (the economy is a funny thing on the PTR, but that's for a later post =P)

So I equipped my Glyph of Innervate, and tried the experiment once again.

WITH Glyph of Innervate, without casting: Again, same conditions: tree form, starting with 0 mana, etc. This time I regened 12.8k, which is 74.2% of my total mana. I tried it two more times, with similar results: 12.7k, and then 12.8k again.

I didn't try the casting experiment with the Glyph. I know, I'm a bad scientist. But I had to wait 6 minutes every time to try it! Plus, have you every actively attempted to run yourself out of mana? It takes a *long* time if you don't do it right. Tip: Tranquility. And lots of Hurricane! In other words, don't sit there in tree form and cast Nourish and Lifebloom for an hour.

Just saying.

So. No longer will Innervate provide us with over-the-top mana returns. 35% while casting? That's like... nothing.

I honestly think that a lot of druids are going to find they're running out of mana in Ulduar, and that the Glyph of Innervate will be used simply to ensure that you're not run bone dry on some fights. I find it frustrating that we'll potentially have to use the glyph for ourselves, rather than for other people. Throwing *others* an Innervate while having that glyph was the essence of it, the beauty of it. The return that you'd get for yourself if you put it on someone else would be so small, I don't think it would be worth it. I tried it a few times, but it seems to be bugged - when I cast it on someone else, I didn't get the Glyph buff myself. =( When I cast it on myself, though, I got the Innervate buff, AND the Innervate glyph buff. So I think something's not right.

I *really* wish that the Lifebloom change was live on the PTR so I could blog about that. I'll also try to get my hands on a Glyph of Nourish on the PTR to see if it stacks with 4piece gear. As soon as it happens (*if* it happens, I should say), I'll be on it =D

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7 remarks:

Keeva said...

I love giving my innervate away and I see it as a buff that I bring for other healers (and mage).. but I get a feeling it will be a rare thing to be able to share after 3.1.

Icedragon said...

Instead of relying on mana returned via innervate, restos might start popping mana pots and downing MP5 buff foods to get our regen back to a desirable level.

Or do what I do: pop a heavy spirit trinket WITH innervate. I managed 6K MP5 on Gluth last night and had the pally wondering what I was smoking when my mana went from zero to 16K mana in about 10 seconds. I can see that being nerfed in the patch, but hopefully not to the extent that the "bare bones" regen was hurt.

Awesome number-pulling. Phae would be proud! :D

Averna said...

@Keeva: And sharing is caring! Not so much after 3.1... =(

@Ice: I have the Spirit World Glass trinket I could use, or another blue one that gives me +29 mp5. I would hate to give up one of my +98 spellpower trinkets, but using Spirit World plus the Innervate sounds like it'd be an efficient way to regain a lot of mana.

But who knows - maybe I won't have to give up those +98 spellpower trinkets, and instead I'll get by with my mana pots and food buffs. I guess we'll have to see.

Anonymous said...

I'am not trying to be an expert as I am not healing since naxx40 but I wasn't living under a rock either about druid mechanics. How about investing (which I guess most druid will do) in Revitalize. Casting Rejuvenation on yourself gives you (considering the must have talent: Nature's Splendor) for a cost of 450(?) mana, 5 ticks that is 75% to proc 15% manapool regen. Maybe it is hight time to invest in intellect more. Today I watched Thorim downed by < Method > from paladin pov and frightening thing I saw - 30k mana pool buffed.

Skroo said...

I play a resto shaman. The 3.1 regen changes do, essentially, nothing to us. This is how our mana has worked all along. Welcome to the potion party.

35% from innevate seems ... pretty good to me actually. A mana tide only does 24%. True, it does it for the whole party, so the difference isn't odd, but hey ... that doesn't help ME. :-)

The mana regen changes are probably going to require more careful group composition that we've been doing lately. The warriors might QQ about losing the Draenei hit aura, but stacking a couple mana tides up with the other healers in the same group is probably a good idea, at least until druids, pallies, and priest figure out how to manage mana post-patch.

Most of the time the shaman world isn't that bad, mana wise, but there are a couple fights where it is just brutal. Phase 3 of KT gets pretty rough. And if there's even one skeleton screwup in P1, I'm Ooomville through roughly 3/4 of P3.

If I could spam every heal I have for 10 minutes and not worry about mana, I would probably be bored out of my skull.

I'm sure there'll be a massive QQing at first, and some gearing adjustments (stay away from my mp5 gear!), but once things settle down I think boss fights will be a lot more interesting for the 3 other healing classes.

taev said...

For a quick/easy way to burn your mana down for testing like this, get naked. Seriously, remove all your gear. That will lower your total mana pool to your base mana pool. Now burn your mana on spells, while you're not bucking against your regen gear.

When your pool is empty enough, just toss your gear back on and commense testing.

arwenofgaia said...

Often times after this patch I found myself using innervate more on myself than others.

Which makes other people go boo hoo.